Lead bag and cloth seals

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Jellytussle
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by Jellytussle »

This is the first cloth seal I've found (I'm assuming it is a cloth seal, as I can see the weave in the left hand image), and I'd appreciate an i.d., please
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StuE
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by StuE »

Yes absolutely right - part of the rivet disc from a two disc cloth seal stamped with incuse S and scratched with 5... The rove disc is missing but the rivet stub has the remains of what I think is part of a privy mark. All in all I would guess that this was a cloth worker's personal seal. Thanks for showing me - go find a more complete one ;)
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Jellytussle
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by Jellytussle »

Thanks for your help, Stu. If I record it as probably dating from 1400-1700 is that sufficiently vague - or can it be tied down any tighter? I've had a look at the FRG datasheet and am none the wiser :g64:

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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by Fishwick »

New phone but managed to work it out. Hope this pictures give some better detail.
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tomredmayne
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by tomredmayne »

Hi Stu. Having looked at this one again, I think it says W 5D across the rivet side...... :g50:

http://www.bagseals.org/gallery/main.ph ... emId=22943
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chasm_norwich
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by chasm_norwich »

These two were found yesterday.
Nice pattern but no writing.
Is the wrong side stamped ???
Can anybody ID them please.
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tomredmayne
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by tomredmayne »

Hi Stu. Another one from my new site. This time looks like a multi-part seal. The face with the flying eagle and a crown above it was folded over and hidden until I unfolded the seal. None of the other faces or the rivet have any design on them.... :g50:
2016_0922_144413AA.jpg
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And opened up a bit more........ :g50:
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woodburner
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by woodburner »

Hello all, found this today Staffordshire it's just under two and a half cms at its longest point :g50:
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tomredmayne
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by tomredmayne »

I think this is your one woodburner http://www.bagseals.org/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=421 :g50:

WEBB & SONS WORDSLEY STOURBRIDGE

THE KING'S SEEDSMEN
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woodburner
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by woodburner »

:g50: cheers Tom

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StuE
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by StuE »

Jellytussle wrote:Thanks for your help, Stu. If I record it as probably dating from 1400-1700 is that sufficiently vague - or can it be tied down any tighter? I've had a look at the FRG datasheet and am none the wiser :g64:
It's probably 1600 - 1700 but maybe safer to go for 1500 - 1800.
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StuE
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by StuE »

tomredmayne wrote:Hi Stu. Having looked at this one again, I think it says W 5D across the rivet side...... :g50:

http://www.bagseals.org/gallery/main.ph ... emId=22943
Updated :g50:
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StuE
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by StuE »

chasm_norwich wrote:These two were found yesterday.
Nice pattern but no writing.
Is the wrong side stamped ???
Can anybody ID them please.
The one on the left is a privy marked cloth workers personal seal - http://www.bagseals.org/gallery/main.ph ... g2_page=20
and the one on the right is a Tudor probably Elizabeth) alnage seal showing the arms of England - http://www.bagseals.org/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=3093

There was no distinction as to which side they stamped - often stamped on both sides with no rule as to which stamp went on which side.
Found any lead bag seals? Email a piccy to me for inclusion on The Bag Seal Gallery Ourpasthistory.com Image Gallery :: Lead Cloth & Bag Seals
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StuE
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by StuE »

tomredmayne wrote:Hi Stu. Another one from my new site. This time looks like a multi-part seal. The face with the flying eagle and a crown above it was folded over and hidden until I unfolded the seal. None of the other faces or the rivet have any design on them.... :g50:
2016_0922_144413AA.jpg
And opened up a bit more........ :g50:
I was going to assign this one to Norwich as they have a series featuring the bird from the Norwich Weavers' arms (from my book, "For a series of Norwich seals featuring birds often with wings addorsed see UKDFD 12704, which is a parallel to No.92 Fig.22 [Egan, G., 1995, p.49]. See also MOL 80.121/5, 95.228/48 and 95.228/61. MOL 81.522/2 has a clipped rivet disc stamped with a bird, wings addorsed and the rove disc and rivet stub are stamped with TO / (S)HO(RT).") but this looks to show an extra wing and possibly a crown above - also it is the rivet and inner disc from a four-disc cloth seals and Norwich were nearly always two-disc cloth seals ... so I'm not sure :) Will add it and see if anything turns up later.

Thanks for pointing Woodburner in the right direction - I think it's the Queens Seedmen version rather than the Kings ;)
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tomredmayne
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Re: Lead bag and cloth seals

Post by tomredmayne »

Thanks again Stu...............fascinating stuff this cloth seal business.........beginning to see why you became interested................ :g50: :g58:
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